Astronomy Proves The Flat Earth Deception

This website exposes the flat earth deception and proves that the earth is globe shaped.

This page provides astronomy proofs that the earth is ball shaped, and is surrounded by stars and planets. We won’t focus on NASA images and information, as they have been accused of being fake.

Instead we will focus on astronomy sources that have no agenda, other than the study of the stars, moon, sun, planets and galaxies.

Questions for flat earthers: What is the scientific explanation for the curved shadow on the moon during a lunar eclipse? If you believe that the sun illuminates the moon, then what is blocking the suns rays from hitting the moon?  If you don’t believe that the sun illuminates the moon, then what is causing the moon to appear this way?

Questions for flat earthers: What is the scientific explanation for the curved shadow on the moon during a lunar eclipse?  What is blocking the sun and caused the curved shadow?

Please comment on the bottom of this page with your answer. Thank you!

The constellations Octans, which is closest to the Southern Pole star, is visible to people who are in southern continents, who are all facing south.  That’s not possible on the flat earth map!

I believe that the evil ones are having NASA publish pictures which can be proven to be fake, so that flat-earthers proclaim that it is part of the cover up.

But fake NASA images and missions, in and of themselves, do not prove the flat earth. Of course they use CGI to create nice photos, they admit as such.

Anyone can buy the SkyView Explore The Universe and Satellite Guide apps to use on their phone, to know where to look in the sky to view planets and satellites. That in itself disproves flat-earthers proclamation that there are no planets or satellites.

Stellarium is a free open source planetarium for your computer, showing you where to look for planets and constellations. It shows a realistic sky in 3D, just like what you see with the naked eye, binoculars or a telescope.

Add in all of the professional and amateur astronomy photographs of the planets and stars, such as Astronomers Without Borders, and you remove all doubt.

Here’s a superb demonstration of how verifiable observations in the real world do not work on a Flat Earth but make perfect sense on the Globe.

Why don’t the stars show up on images of the moon, and of earth from the ISS?

Here’s a video of the star trails which were recorded from the Equator.

If the earth were flat, then there would only be one circle of stars; but we can clearly see two opposing circles, which proves that the Earth is a globe.

People in the Southern Hemisphere can’t see Polaris, the North Star; because the curve of the globe earth prevents them from seeing it.

People in the Southern Hemisphere can't see Polaris, the North Star; because the curve of the globe earth prevents them from seeing it.

People in the Southern Hemisphere can all look South and see Alpha Crucis, but that is not possible on the flat earth model.

People in the Southern Hemisphere can all look South and see Alpha Crucis, but that is not possible on the flat earth model.

People in the Southern Hemisphere can all look South and see the South Celestial Pole star, Sigma Octantis, which is only possible on a globe earth.

On the flat earth model, if people in Australia, South Africa and South America, were all facing South, they would be facing opposite directions, so there is no way that they can all see the South Celestial Pole star, which does not move.

Yet people in those three Southern Hemisphere continents can look South and see the South Celestial Pole star, and see the stars circling around it.

On the flat earth model, if people in Australia, South Africa and South America, were all facing South, they would be facing opposite directions. Yet people in those three Southern Hemisphere continents can look South and see the South Celestial Pole star, and see the stars circling around it. This proves that the North and South Pole stars are at the top and bottom of the ball of lights, and the other stars are circling the globe Earth.

Stars circling the South Celestial Pole from Sydney, Australia

South Pole Star from Sydney Australia proves the globe Earth

Stars circling the South Celestial Pole from Reunion Island, South Africa

South Pole Star from Reunion Island, South Africa proves the globe Earth

Stars circling the South Celestial Pole from Santiago, Chile

South Pole Star from Santiago Chile proves the globe Earth

This proves that the North and South Pole stars are at the top and bottom of the Earth, and the other stars are circling the globe Earth.

This proves that the North and South Pole stars are at the top and bottom of the Earth, and the other stars are circling the globe Earth.

An Equatorial Mount on a Telescope will allow you to track the Sun and Stars with a single axis of rotation.

If an object is moving in circles above a flat Earth this would be completely impossible. You would require two axes of movement to follow it.

Flat earthers use images like this to proclaim that planets are fake. 

Many of them are from a Nikon P900, which a great little camera with a big zoom lens; but it has a small aperture, so it is not designed to take pictures of small bright objects, such distant stars and planets.

The problem is simply that the P900 cannot focus on a small point light source. So what we are seeing is planets that are blurred and out of focus. And since it’s essentially a point light source it forms an “orb” shape, commonly referred to as Bokeh.

Flat earth planet images

There are Astronomy societies all around the world, who show through optical telescopes the stars, moon, sun, planets and galaxies.

To say that they are all part of the flat earth conspiracy is ridiculous!

Astronomers Without Borders features photos from people around the world.

Hamilton Amateur Astronomers is a non-profit organization dedicated to the enjoyment and advancement of astronomy. It is the largest independent astronomy club in Canada.

Here is a link to the Denver Astronomy Society and the Colorado Springs Astronomical Society, as a few examples.

Find a local group who will let you look through their telescopes, to see the planets; to prove that what flat earthers teach is not true.

In The Sky virtual planetarium uses your location to let you know where to look in the sky for constellations and planets.

Anyone can buy the SkyView Explore The Universe and Satellite Guide apps to use on their phone, to know where to look in the sky to view planets and satellites.

The Virtual Telescope Project lets you use a remote telescope to view the planets,  solar system, star clusters, nebulae and galaxies.

Here is a link to their Virtual Telescope Project photo gallery.

There are many Astrophotographers, such as

This video needs no explanation; it simply and quickly illustrates the biggest problem for the Flat Earth model of the Earth. There is no math involved, it is easy to verify for yourself, and anyone can understand the problem from a single view of this video.

.Many Bible verses point to the stars of the Mazzaroth, so they are real.

When Elohim was questioning Job, He pointed out His command of the Mazzaroth, the twelve signs in the circle of the Zodiac.

Do you bind the bands of Kimah (Pleiades), or loosen the cords of Kesil (Orion)? Do you bring out the constellations (Mazzaroth ) in its season? Or do you lead the Bear (Arcturus) with its sons? Job 38:31-32

The great plan of redemption was told through the stars, long before written records were in place.  It is defined with star groups and the names of individual stars.

The heavens (Mazzaroth) are proclaiming the esteem of Ěl; And the expanse is declaring the work of His hand.

Day to day pours forth speech, And night to night reveals knowledge.

There is no speech, and there are no words, Their voice is not heard.

Their line (ecliptic) has gone out through all the earth, And their words to the end of the world. In them He set up a tent for the sun (picture of Yahusha, the Sun of Righteousness, Malachi 4:2),

And it is like a bridegroom coming out of his room, It rejoices like a strong man to run the path.

Its rising is from one end of the heavens, And its circuit to the other end; And naught is hidden from its heat. Psalms 19:1-6

The enemy, Satan, has perverted the story of redemption by causing pagan empires to create alternative stories about the stars.

He has caused believers to shun any knowledge of the zodiac, as he has conditioned them to believe that it is evil.

But the constellations of the Zodiac were created by your Father in heaven, to declare His love for you, and to declare His plan of redemption.

He appoints the number of the stars, He gives names to all of them.” Psalm 147:4

God’s Voice in the Stars – Zodiac Signs And Bible Truths by Ken Fleming

2 Kings 23:5 clearly proclaims the existence of planets; which flatearthers deny:

And he put down the idolatrous priests, whom the kings of Judah had ordained to burn incense in the high places in the cities of Judah, and in the places round about Jerusalem; them also that burned incense unto Baal, to the sun, and to the moon, and to the planets, and to all the host of heaven.”

Revelation 12:1 uses the illustration of the constellation Virgo to tell the story of the Satan-empowered Roman beast seeking to wipe out the Early Church.

And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:”

Revelation 12 sign. Flat earthers dismiss the heliocentric model, which has the constellations in a circle around the globe Earth; on which the sun, moon and planets, appear on the ecliptic, to convey a message.

Nine of the stars are from the constellation Leo, but the other three are planets (Venus, Mars and Mercury) which are lined up on the ecliptic, above her head.

This exact celestial alignment will occur on September 23, 2017

The Southern Cross is only visible to those in the southern hemisphere.

The south celestial pole can be located from the Southern Cross (Crux) and its two “pointer” stars α Centauri and β Centauri. Draw an imaginary line from γ Crucis to α Crucis—the two stars at the extreme ends of the long axis of the cross—and follow this line through the sky.

Southern Cross only in southern hemisphere

Either go four and a half times the distance of the long axis in the direction the narrow end of the cross points, or join the two pointer stars with a line, divide this line in half, then at right angles draw another imaginary line through the sky until it meets the line from the Southern Cross. This point is 5 or 6 degrees from the south celestial pole. Very few bright stars of importance lie between Crux and the pole itself, although the constellation Musca is fairly easily recognized immediately beneath Crux.

Flat Earth’s Greatest Challenge: Southern Stars

If you were in Alaska and looked towards the North Star you would see that star remain roughly stationary and all the other stars will circle it like seen in the time lapsed photos here: if you were in South Africa, you will not be able to see the North Star (because the spherical earth is in the way), but if you look due south, you will see the circle of the stars go in the opposite direction.

If you are at the equator, you can see something even different (look north and see the stars moving counter clockwise and look south and see them moving clockwise).

The crescent shape of the moon appears inversely between people in the northern and southern hemispheres.

If Earth is flat, how can billions of people see two different sets of constellations rotating in opposite directions, around two opposite poles?

How can people in the southern hemisphere essentially stand in a circle with their backs to each other, and all be facing the same southern constellation?

If 2 people in Australia and South America are standing with their backs to the north pole, and therefore facing in different directions, how are they all able to see the southern pole star (Sigma Octantis)?

If Earth is flat, how can billions of people see two different sets of constellations rotating in opposite directions, around two opposite poles?

The Southern Cross cannot be seen in both New Zealand and South Africa on the Flat Earth.

South Africa is in the same time zone as Germany, but at night Germans see the North Star while South Africans are viewing the Southern Cross. The Southern cross is also seen by those in New Zealand. It is only possible on a round earth as they can see the same sky.

 Only on a globe earth can people in South Africa and New Zealand see the Southern Cross

The question, begs, since all out of the outer part of the flat earth is supposedly ‘south’, where is the Southern Cross located at?

No matter where you put it, it would not be possible for people in South Africa and New Zealand to both see it, as they are one opposite sides of the supposed flat earth.

People in New Zealand and South Africa cannot both see the southern cross.


Flat earthers have no way to explain these 2017 celestial events, which we can see with our eyes:

February 26: Annular Solar Eclipse

March 20: Spring Equinox, when the sun will rise due East, and set due West, because the Sun is so far away that every location has the same basic angle to the sun.  This is not possible on the flat earth, as people in the Northern hemisphere would have a very different angle that people in the Southern hemisphere.

April 22/23: Lyrid Meteor Shower

May 5/6: Eta Aquarid Meteors

June 9: Micromoon, when the Full Moon is at apogee, the farthest point from Earth, making June’s Strawberry Moon a Micromoon. This Full Moon looks around 12 to 14% smaller than its counterpart, the Supermoon.

July 3: Earth at Aphelion, when Earth will be at aphelion: the furthest point from the Sun in its yearly orbit.

August 7/8: Partial Lunar Eclipse

August 12/13: Perseid Meteors

August 21: Total Solar Eclipse

September 22: Fall Equinox, when the sun will rise due East, and set due West, from every location on earth, because the Sun is so far away that every location has the same basic angle to the sun.  This is not possible on the flat earth, as people in the Northern hemisphere would have a very different angle that people in the Southern hemisphere.

October 8: Draconid Meteor Shower

October 20/21: Orionid Meteors

November 17/18: Leonid Meteor Shower

December 3/4: Supermoon, when the full moon looks around 12 to 14% larger than its counterpart, the Micromoon.

December 13/14: Geminids Meteors

December 23/24: Ursid Meteors

The great astronomers of history:

The story that Christians believed in a flat earth until Columbus’ time, and for some time thereafter, began as part of a fictional story that was elevated to historical fact by late 19th-century Darwinists who used it primarily as a means to ridicule Christians.

The spherical shape of the earth was known to the ancient Greeks, who even made some good estimates of its circumference and, contrary to the claims of the flat-earth myth perpetuators, was never lost.

One well-known example is Eratosthenes who measured the earth’s diameter fairly accurately in the 3rd century BC.30 Eratosthenes calculated the circumference using geometry to within 3.5% of the true value.

The ancient Greek experimenters knew its shape by evaluating a variety of evidences, including the earth’s shadow during a lunar eclipse and the changing sky as one travels northward and southward.1 The ancients knew much about astronomy because they spent a great deal of time studying the heavens and stars for navigation purposes and because of their strong interest in astrology.

Claudius Ptolemy (85-165 A.D., Greek) was an astronomer who used Hipparchus’ extensive observations to develop a model that predicted the movements of the Sun, Moon, planets, and stars. His model, called the Ptolemaic system, visualized an Earth-centered universe and assumed that all astronomical objects move at constant speeds in circular orbits. The circle was considered by the ancients to be the perfect shape, and regardless of the evidence against circular orbits, Ptolemy built his model to fit this idea. The Ptolemaic model is one of the longest upheld scientific theories in history: it was the cornerstone of astronomy for 1,500 years.

Aristotle (384-322 B.C., Greek), the great philosopher, proved that the Earth is spherical, and believed that it was at the center of the universe. His reason for believing this was actually quite scientific: he knew that if the Earth revolved around the Sun, then we should see the stars shift position throughout the year. Since he did not have the technology to detect this shift, as we do today, he concluded that Earth must rest at the center of the universe. According to him, the Sun, planets, and stars were located in spheres that revolved around the Earth.

Anaximander (611-547 B.C., Ionian) was a Greek philosopher who made the first detailed maps of the Earth and the sky. He knew that the Earth was round, and believed that it was free-floating and unsupported. He measured its circumference, and was the first to put forward the idea that celestial bodies make full circles in their orbits. One of his greatest contributions was the fact that he was the first to conceptualize space as having depth.


Nicolaus Copernicus (1473-1543, Polish) began a new era of astronomy when he concluded that the Sun was the center of the universe instead of the Earth. Copernicus felt that the Ptolemaic system was contrived, but in his revisions of that model, he kept the orbits circular. The revolutionary idea was not popular with the Church, but several other astronomers such as Brahe and Galileo helped to eventually prove that this model of the universe more accurately portrayed reality.

Tycho Brahe (1546-1601, Danish) built an observatory from which he made the most accurate astronomical observations up to that time. His observatory contained sophisticated equipment for mapping star positions, and for more than 20 years he made detailed records of his findings. He believed that the universe was a blend of the Ptolemaic and Copernican models, and created his own model in which the planets orbit the Sun and the Sun orbits the Earth.

Giovanni Cassini (1625-1712, Italian) was the astronomer who first discovered the division in the rings of Saturn, today known as the Cassini division. He also found four moons orbiting Saturn, and measured the periods of rotation of Mars and Jupiter. The Cassini space mission currently on its way to Saturn was named after him.

Galileo Galilei (1564-1642, Italian) is the father of observational astronomy. In 1609, he heard about the Dutch invention of the telescope, and built one for himself. Even though his telescope was not very powerful compared to the amateur equipment available today, he was able to make a number of stunning discoveries which changed the face of astronomy. He saw the craters, mountains, and valleys of the Moon, noticed the huge number of stars making up the Milky Way, kept precise records of sunspot activity and the phases of Venus, and discovered four moons orbiting Jupiter. These moons are still called the Galilean Moons today, in honor of the earth-shattering scientific effects of the discovery. During a time when the Earth was still considered to be at the center of the universe, he publicized the fact that other astronomical bodies, such as Jupiter’s moons, were clearly revolving around something other than the Earth. Galileo’s support of the Copernican model of the universe frightened the Church, which put Galileo on trial in 1633. He was forced to renounce his Copernican views and was held under house arrest for the rest of his life.

William Herschel (1738-1822, British) was the discover of Uranus and two of its moons. He also discovered two more moons of Saturn and several asteroids, and made a catalog of 2,500 astronomical objects. He found the polar ice caps on Mars, which are today being studied by several satellites in the hopes of shedding light on the existence of water on Mars.

Annie Jump Cannon (1863-1941, American) was a member of the famous group of Harvard astronomers called ‘Pickering’s Women’. The director of the Harvard College Observatory, Edward Pickering, hired a number of women to sort through and organize mounds of data on the stellar classification of stars. The stars were classified by their spectra, and Annie Cannon was the most prolific and careful of the workers. She single-handedly classified 400,000 stars into the scheme we use today (O B A F G K M), and discovered 300 variable stars. She paved the way for women entering the astronomical field.

Henry Russell (1877-1957, American) was the one inventor of the Hertzsprung-Russell diagram describing the spectral types of stars. He measured the parallax of the stars photographically, allowing them to be properly placed on the H-R diagram.

Edwin Hubble (1889-1953, American) made an incredible contribution to astronomy and cosmology when he discovered that faraway galaxies are moving away from us. Known as Hubble’s Law, the theory states that galaxies recede from each other at a rate proportional to their distance from each other. This concept is a cornerstone of the Big Bang model of the universe.

Jan Oort (1900-1992, Dutch) first measured the distance between our solar system and the center of the Milky Way Galaxy and calculated the mass of the Milky Way. An enormous contribution of his was the proposal of a large number of icy comets left over from the formation of the solar system, now known as the Oort Cloud.

References for more study:

How Polaris Proves the Earth is Round


View Sky from Cities around the World

Goofy flat earth explanations about Astronomy:
























86 thoughts on “Astronomy Proves The Flat Earth Deception”

  1. I would like all the flat earther’s to do this one thing, and I’ll never disbelieve them again. I would like all the flat earthers to go find an edge of the earth, and then I would like them all to, jump! If they fall off I’ll believe them, if they don’t, then please, stop your nonsense!

    • They dismiss all photos of the globe from space, but they have no photos of the supposed dome or the edge of the flat earth. Makes no sense to me.

  2. I will leave disputes over who said what to others. However, I took a look at the Anaximander map on wikip and I see how a flatearther might embrace/defend him. It looks like an extremely crude flat earth map. I know nothing about Anaximander and would, like most of us, rely on sources like Wikip.. which says, in part:

    “Anaximander was the first to conceive a mechanical model of the world. In his model, the Earth floats very still in the center of the infinite, not supported by anything. It remains “in the same place because of its indifference”, a point of view that Aristotle considered ingenious, but false, in On the Heavens.[33] Its curious shape is that of a cylinder[34] with a height one-third of its diameter. The flat top forms the inhabited world, which is surrounded by a circular oceanic mass.”

    So, he proposed earth as a cylinder and surrounded by a circular oceanic mass and the Earth is GEOCENTRIC! He suggests it is NOT supported by pillars.

    But, when it comes to the true shape of the earth, what Jeran and all flatearthers are either ignorant of or purposely avoiding is the fact that ALL map makers have had the exact same problem…. making a flat map that matches the on-the-ground measurements. This has been the problem for hundreds of years, since the beginning of map making. Sailors and scouts take detailed measurements of land and sea. When they try to lay down those measurements on a flat map, it simply DOES NOT WORK. The ONLY answer is that the Earth is round because it is impossible to represent a sphere on a flat map. THIS is why nobody will take my challenge. I could offer $100,000 and it would go unclaimed for eternity. It can’t be done.

    Jeran? You there? Surely you have an accurate flat earth map, or a logical reason why none exists.

    • Thanks for the information TJ! Here’s the bottom line. Though I cite some astronomers who taught the globe earth, people can debate all day about what they knew and were teaching.

      The truth is that this website is full of simple, logical, observable proofs that the earth is a globe and not flat. it’s interesting that flat earthers don’t address the many explanations on this website, and they don’t prove that the explanations are wrong. They just attack and make silly points.

  3. Hey David & Jeran,

    Did you know that the Jeran above is the infamous flatearther of Jeranism? You must be popular to have such a well known flatearther read and post on your site!

    So, Jeran, will you take my map challenge? I will offer $10,000 to you or anyone who can produce an accurate flat earth map. If it’s flat, an accurate map would be EXTREMELY EASY TO MAKE. You can even leave off Antarctica (or the ice wall.) We know the shapes and sizes of all the other continents, so, a map from the north pole to the tips of Africa and S. America will be just fine. If $10,000 is not enough, just let me now how much it will take to get one.

    TJ Jones

    • Yeah, I clicked on his website link to find out who he is.

      The weird thing is that he accused me of saying something that I didn’t said. Then he doesn’t even reply about that quote.

      Obviously he ignored all of the explanations on this page and the website, and just focused on one point, that Anaximander supposedly believed that the earth was a cylinder.

      I ain’t no rocket scientist 😛 but wouldn’t the circumference that Anaximander estimated be the same on a globe-shaped earth and a cylinder-shaped earth?

      The point is that his estimation was pretty accurate. He obviously wasn’t estimating the measurement of the size of the flat earth, as that would be much bigger.

  4. Wow countless lies throughout this article. Let’s start small and give you a chance to prove your claims. Can you please provide me with the evidence that allowed you to say that, “despite the claims of flat earth myth pushers, we have not lost the works of the ancient Greeks.” Okay so, I’d be happy with Eratosthenes work or Anaximander. Look forward to seeing or being linked to these documents that have not been lost and rewritten in 1600.

    Then I read Anaximander measured the circumference if earth? Okay please provide evidence of this from 500 bc. Certainly would be interesting since he thought earth was a cylinder. So please prove my research wrong because these two are a good place to start with the untruths you push as fact with no evidence.

    • I searched the website for this phrase “despite the claims of flat earth myth pushers, we have not lost the works of the ancient Greeks” and can’t find it. Where did you see that?

  5. Excellent point. I wasn’t taking into account that for retrograde to be observed, both the observer and the target planet have to be moving. But, now, I am confused again. If Earth is motionless, doesn’t that mean we should never see retrograde of any heavenly body? And, if we are orbiting the Sun, we would never see it go into retrograde, which agrees with observation. What am I missing? And is there something on your site I might have missed?

    Also, admittedly, I have not read Geo-centrism 101, please tell me what it says about retrograde.


  6. Yes, but… wouldn’t the Earth appear to go into retrograde when viewed from Mars? And, from Jupiter, etc.? I think the clue is that the Sun never goes into retrograde from the vantage point of Earth. Think about that. If we can view other planets going into retrograde, why not the Sun? I think this is strong evidence that all the planets, including Earth, revolve around the Sun. So, why doesn’t the Sun ever go into retrograde?

    • The view from Mars or Jupiter towards earth certainly would be different in the geocentric model than the heliocentric.

      If the sun is revolving around the earth, then it appear wouldn’t go into retrograde, as it’s orbit is a continuous circle around earth. The other planets revolve around the sun, so they are going in a circle around it, and the sun moves around the earth; which is why the other planets like Mars retrograde.

  7. Hey David,

    I was re-reading your Hidden Geo page and realized something. The first video shows how it’s not possible to tell the difference whether the sun is the center or earth is the center. I would suggest that is absolutely true, but, I believe that claim relates to one’s perspective from each vantage point. Wouldn’t the same be true if we used Mars (or any of the other planets) instead of Earth as the center? I started looking for details. In addition to the Earth rotating every 24 hours, it is alleged that the sun and all the planets rotate on their axis, and each is tilted to a certain degree. Here is a link to a graphic that shows each planet’s alleged degree of tilt:
    Here is a link that tells how long it takes each planet to allegedly rotate once.
    Surprisingly, (and maybe I already knew this and forgot) Mars takes virtually the same as Earth. Do you see where I am going with this? From Mars, the same perspective rule applies. Standing on the surface of Mars, it would appear that the solar system and universe rotate around the observer approx. every 24 hours. It would appear that Earth moved around Mars; and Mars would appear to be motionless… the center of the universe. This is what is meant when they say it’s indistinguishable. I am not sure simply substituting the center of the model is proof of a geocentric reality because you can pick any planet to be the center, and it still works. I think it is only proof that the position or vantage point of each observer affects what is observed. Am I wrong? Your thoughts?

    • Hey TJ. Thanks for sharing your input. What you said seems to make sense.

      Since the sun orbits around the earth and the planets orbit around the sun; that is why planets appear to go in retrograde motion, they seem to be going backwards from an earthly perspective.

      What amazes me is that very few people even consider the geocentric globe earth perspective, which seems to be the best explanation. The enemy is slick! David

  8. Scott, as for the spin of the Earth, it is much more difficult for me to find absolute evidence like I can with the shape. I have not found conclusive information regarding the coriolis effect and I think the distances are so small that it is hard to call this effect concrete evidence. For me, I have to do what David suggests… search for truth and not try to defend a belief. Though I am a believer, I do not “believe” that Scripture says the Earth is motionless any more than I think it says the Earth is flat. Unmovable, yes. Motionless, no. If the firmament is really just another name for space; and, if the galaxies are really out there and really as far away as we are told, then there is simply no way a distant galaxy could move all the way around us in a 24 hr. period. At those speeds, distant galaxies would fly apart from centrifugal forces. Neither you, nor I, nor David, nor 99.9% of humans are capable of measuring how far away other galaxies are, so, there is no proving it. Someone would need to explain to me how such CIRCULAR speeds are possible for me to even consider the geocentric model.

    Here, I would like to mention something about the movie The Principle. I watched most of it. What I found in my research is that the aligning of the cosmos with Earth is not exact. It’s close, but, it is not EXACTLY aligned. I can only assume it is possible that of all the orientations, ours just happens to be close to what the CMB indicates. I think in a truly geocentric model, created by intelligent design, if there was some reason to make such an alignment, it would be exact. Therefore, for those who suggest our alignment with the cosmos has meaning, I would ask, then what is the meaning of a NEAR-PERFECT alignment? Why isn’t it perfectly aligned?

  9. Hey Scott,

    I think this discussion is great. We are talking about two issues. One, being the shape of the Earth. The other being the geo vs. helio models.

    Re the shape, early on, I noticed these discrepancies in the size of continents depending on what model/map I was looking at. I had been using Google maps for years and never noticed how enormous Greenland was. I started playing around with the measurement tools. I noticed that even though Greenland appeared to be as big as Africa, when I measured it, the measurements were correct. Just try it, it’s weird. The first video I came across showed these discrepancies. Unfortunately, the presenter said it was because of a huge conspiracy and even Google was in on it. I found that hard to believe, so, I did my own research. What I found was that humans knew the shape of most continents by the 1600’s and FLAT maps were produced that contained fairly accurate shapes. However, the sizes and distances on flat world maps were ALWAYS wrong, and they always will be. Then I found a great video that has nothing to do with flat earth theory at youtube- “Why all world maps are wrong”. My eyes were opened. After I watched this video, I realized that ALL map makers over the last 500+ years all had the same problem with trying to transcribe their measurements onto a flat surface. It simply does not work, and it never will, hence my map challenge. The more that time passed, the more map makers realized that their measurements ONLY worked on a globe…. period. This led me to the logical conclusion that there is no way all those map makers over hundreds of years could have been in collusion to trick me and the rest of the world. I realize now that all flat maps are wrong because shape and/or size and/or distance has to be compromised. I came to the conclusion that if the SHAPES, SIZES AND DISTANCES were all correct on a globe, then the Earth MUST be a globe. It simply can’t be any other way.

    Having said that, flatearthers try to tell me that all the map makers were either all in cahoots, or all using the same tainted measurements. This, too, I found impossible to believe. Remember, hundreds of years ago, the SHAPE of most continents were measured by one simple action… sailing around the continent. Just google “1600’s world maps” and you will see that the SHAPES were pretty close, especially of Africa and S. America. They did this by measuring their direction and speed. If they could measure the distance of a coastline, they could measure the distances between continents. Again, flatearthers come at me suggesting that ocean currents and wind cause the measurements to appear A LOT shorter than they actually are. I don’t believe this either.

    • Thanks again for sharing your insight TJ!

      As you said, there’s no way that all map-makers were carrying out some grand conspiracy! And they proved that the earth is a globe.

      Geodetic surveying reveals that the angles of the measured triangle exceed 180 degrees, proving that the Earth is curved. This is called ‘spherical excess’.

      If the Earth was flat, the angles would add up to 180 degrees.



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